if the devil didn't exist man would create himif the devil didn't exist man would create him

Bart Ehrman, welcome back to FRESH AIR. And they get that from several passages in the Book of Revelation. Juxtaposition The Devil In The White City 622 Words | 3 Pages. And right, it kind of seems like that when you read it - when you just kind of simply read it. Write CSS OR LESS and hit save. You could, I suppose, use the word plague, and the word, you know, plague is in the Hebrew Bible. Kevin Spacey? Season 2 of Untold has arrived and it's more viral than ever! The prophet Isaiah recalls this event: "You said in your heart, 'I will ascend to heaven. Visit our website terms of use and permissions pages at www.npr.org for further information. But it doesn't work that way, folks! All content copyright original author unless stated otherwise. For example, in his 1768 essay on inventing God, he refutes three philosophers who posed as God. However, it coul. He was the one who bringing them into it. It's not that they're going to live on forever. So for them, there's no resurrection of the dead. And so people often point to that as an instance that's - well, so people are alive after they're dead. (This question emerged from a discussion of The Usual Suspects. So how does that shift happen? Here is an excerpt in French:[3]Date: February 7, 1864, Newspaper: Le Figaro, Story Collection: Le Spleen de Paris, Story: Le Joueur Gnreux, Author: Charles Baudelaire, Start Page 4, Quote Page 5, Column 1, Newspaper Location: Continue reading, Elle ne se plaignit en aucune faon de la mauvaise rputation dont elle jouit dans toutes les parties du monde, massura quelle tait, elle-mme, la personne la plus intresse la destruction de la superstition, et mavoua quelle navait eu peur, relativement son propre pouvoir, quune seule fois, ctait le jour o elle avait entendu un prdicateur, plus subtil que le reste du troupeau humain, scrier en chaire: Mes chers frres, noubliez jamais, quand vous entendrez vanter le progrs des lumires, que la plus belle des ruses du Diable est de vous persuader quil nexiste pas! (SOUNDBITE OF PETROS KLAMPANIS' "EASY COME EASY GO"). Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. But eventually, in Christianity, the idea was that since the soul is eternal, it's either rewarded eternally or it's punished eternally. In the new book, "Heaven And Hell: A History Of The Afterlife," my guest Bart Ehrman writes about where the ideas of heaven and hell came from. But it's not a place where you continue to exist afterwards. It would be his downfall. For Paul, Jesus was going to come back from heaven and bring in God's kingdom here on Earth, and people would be raised from the dead for glorious eternity. Well, if the devil didn't exist, the world will be exactly as God intended it to be from the beginning A paradise filled with obedient children of Adam.. GROSS: You've talked about how belief in the end times led in a circuitous way to belief in heaven and hell. I actually consider myself both an atheist and an agnostic because I - you know, I don't really know if there's a superior being in the universe, but I don't believe there is. | Who Is The Youngest In BTS? Voltaire argued that the Gospels were fakes, and the teachings of Jesus were fabricated. The tears of the innocent that you cause to flow, Satan would desire plenty of recognition, especially from those that would follow him into iniquity, since he bamboozles the nave suckers that it's perfectly all right to keep sinning, to get away with anything, even murder. R. R. Stark| There is hope in moments of complete despair. Or it's because of, you know, one social ill or another that God is punishing. In the book of James, the Holy Spirit says, But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. He was raised Jewish. Don't we need a hideous hell to contrast the beauty of heaven? EHRMAN: Yeah, I've thought a lot about it. If someone wants to assume an official position, We and our partners use data for Personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, audience insights and product development. In vain you raise as an objection to me the hypocritical insolence Satan is working his way, and that it's because we're at the end of time, and he has to be released here at the end of time before God will intervene. And so these people who converted to Christianity were principally Greek thinkers, they thought there was a soul that live forever. The people, in the Book of Revelation, human beings who aren't on the side of God, are actually destroyed. About 200 before Jesus was born, there was a shift in thinking in ancient Israel that became - it became a form of ideology, a kind of religious thought that scholars today call apocalypticism. Eager to throw themselves amidst the factions, So their punishment is they would not get the kingdom of God. Why Are Prefab Sports Buildings Getting Popular? As a writer, Voltaire wrote numerous memorable aphorisms. Satan fell because of his pride and disobedience to the Lord. Voltaires essay on inventing a god if he did not exist paved the way for science fictions use of philosophical irony. They all adored a master, a judge, a father. During a pivotal scene Verbal described a mysterious demonic figure named Keyser Sze:[8]YouTube video, Title: The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince the world he didnt exist, Uploaded on April 30, 2009, Uploaded by: iPhilR, (Quotation starts at 0 minute 4 Continue reading. It would be his downfall. But is it beneficial? Get our Question of the Week delivered right to your inbox! I have native specimens as, well, even better than the Turkish ones. To testify to his beliefs; rather they will swear to his good conduct. And the graphic imagery in the book has really contributed to all of these interpretations of Revelation. He will no longer bring along two witnesses 2 And so they denied the idea of the resurrection of the body. The notion of a demon running around wagging its tail whilst brandishing a garden fork is at best comical and at worst absurd. What fruit do you expect to reap from your fine arguments? A human father is a limited (and fallen) human being, so the comparison is not strictly accurate and can create some misunderstandings. Texas | 167 views, 4 likes, 0 loves, 6 comments, 2 shares, Facebook Watch Videos from Shekinah Tabernacle Baptist Church of Dallas, TX: Shekinah. One is they based their predictions on the Book of Revelation. In 1856 Spiritualism, a Satanic Delusion, and a Sign of the Times by Pastor William Ramsey included this passage:[2]1856, Spiritualism, a Satanic Delusion, and a Sign of the Times by William Ramsey (Pastor of the Cedar Street Presbyterian Church, Philadelphia), Chapter 2: The Case Stated, Quote Page 33, Edited by Continue reading. Even Adam would have still be alive if the devil didn't show up. Abroad they apparently no longer do any, beating nowadays; either their morals have been purified or theyve passed, such laws that apparently one man no longer dares to whip another; but. GROSS: And you say that for the ancient Jews, the fact that the Messiah didn't come, that was a turning point in beliefs about what happens after death, too. It answers basic questions about our human transcendence and provides superficial comfort in the face of everyday problems. For not believing in God, will he pay you better? They're not? So the bottom line of the book is that the way you kind of trace the history of heaven and hell is that when people thought that everybody dies and it's the same for everybody forever, they thought, well, that's not fair. / Miracles Don't Exist. His new book is Heaven and Hell: A History of the Afterlife. GROSS: Thank you. (2) (3) (4). If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him This statement by Voltaire was so famous that Flaubert included it in his Dictionnaire des ides reues, and it is still frequently quoted today. While Patouillet was insulting me in vain. God has ordained that Satan have a long leashwith God holding onto itbecause he knows that when we walk in and out of those temptations, struggling both with the physical and moral effects that they bring, more of God's glory will shine in that battle than if he took Satan out yesterday. What would become of evil if there was no Grand Master of Evil to orchestrate it? So then, if he DIDN'T exist, we would actually be living exactly the same way, believing in a God that is not there." Sometimes Sheol is translated by the word hell, and it absolutely is not what people think of as hell. So I wasn't always a pleasant person to be around because I was right and they were wrong, and since they were wrong, they were going to hell. To view the purposes they believe they have legitimate interest for, or to object to this data processing use the vendor list link below. When he was on trial, on capital charges - so it was a death sentence awaiting him - he was talking with his companions about what death would be, and his view is that it's one of two things. (SOUNDBITE OF MICHAEL NYMAN'S "HOW DO I KNOW YOU KNOW?". Voltaire, who was one of the first to reject the teachings of Christianity, attacked this religion with fierce zeal. My dear elderly mother is a very good Christian, and she believes that she will die and she will go to heaven and she will see her husband. And so I think that hell is something we need to fight against; heaven, I'm all for. Ivan, not Dostoyevsky. Christianity's Seven Deadly "Sins" the World Will Not Forgive! Keyser Sze? You know, with us its beating, the, birch and the lash, thats our national way: with us nailed ears are, unthinkable, were Europeans after all, but the birch, the lashthat is ours, and cannot be taken from us. . Instead, He created the person who became the Devil. When he became convinced that Jesus was raised from the dead, he thought that the resurrection had started. If the devil didn't exist, this question wouldn't exist. What can you do after Valentines Day to make your sweetheart happy? There have always been people who actually picked a time when it's going to happen. This Richard was, someones illegitimate child; at the age of six he was, parents to some Swiss mountain shepherds, who brought him up to work for, them. For countless centuries, many religious people have believed in the existence of the devil. It is quite dangerous to refuse the findings of science because of your personal beliefs. I'll occasionally walk around the block if nobody's around. This sublime system is necessary to man. Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / What If, The Devil Don't Exist, Will You Still Be A Christian? Either we live on and we see those we knew before and those we didn't know before, and we spend all of our time being with them, which for him was absolute paradise because Socrates liked nothing better than conversing with people, and so now he could converse with Homer and with all the greats of the Greek past. . Image Notes: Portrait of Charles Baudelaire by Emile Deroy circa 1844; accessed via Wikimedia Commons. Emphasis added to excerpts by QI:[1]1836, Quakerism Examined: In a Reply to the Letter of Samuel Tuke by John Wilkinson, Chapter 4: Is the Sacrifice of Christ Held in Proper Estimation by the Society of Friends?, Quote Page 239 and Continue reading. In 1864 Le Figaro published the tale Le Joueur Gnreux (The Generous Gambler) by Charles Baudelaire. Log in or register to write something here or to contact authors. Alas! The baby laughs with glee, holds out its little hands to the pistol, and he pulls the trigger in the baby's face and blows out its brains. They are wiped out. Good people have believed me: the evil ones, crushed, But the main thing is that I think that, in fact, it imposes emotional damage. "I think the devil doesn't exist, but man has created him, he has created him in his own image and likeness." - Fyodor Dostoevsky . God will destroy the forces of evil. Why would God not destroy Satan at the cost of many innocent . People can't help itthey need something bigger than themselves to believe in, so if God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent Him. impossible for us, though, by the way, it seems to be taking root here, especially since the time of the religious movement in our higher society. Would they no longer have the pleasure of trembling in fear for such a devilish being? GROSS: Are there things in the Hebrew Bible that still support the idea of heaven and hell as people came to understand it, things that you can extract from the Old Testament that might not literally mention heaven and hell but still support the vision that emerged of it? As you said, this is going to be what my next book is on, is about how people have misinterpreted Revelation as a prediction of about what's going to happen in our future. And these are more mystical texts. And so in the Old Testament, there's no idea that your soul goes one place or another because the soul doesn't exist apart from the body. Apparently, the prominent French literary figure Charles Baudelaire said something similar. EHRMAN: Right. The original text contained the mistaken phrase your hear instead of you hear:[4]1918 November, The English Review, Edited by Austin Harrison, Volume 27, The Generous Gambler by Charles Baudelaire, Translated from French by Arthur Symons, Start Page 354, Quote Page 355, Published Continue reading, He complained in no way of the evil reputation under which he lived, indeed, all over the world, and he assured me that he himself was of all living beings the most interested in the destruction of Superstition, and he avowed to me that he had been afraid, relatively as to his proper power, once only, and that was on the day when he had heard a preacher, more subtle than the rest of the human herd, cry in his pulpit: My dear brethren, do not ever forget, when your hear the progress of lights praised, that the loveliest trick of the Devil is to persuade you that they dont exist!, Here is a 1919 translation by Joseph T. Shipley:[5]1919, Baudelaire: His Prose and Poetry by Charles Baudelaire, Edited by T. R. Smith, Series: The Modern Library of the Worlds Best Books, Story: The Generous Player, Translated by Joseph T. Continue reading, He did not in any way bemoan the bad reputation which he enjoys in all parts of the world, assured me that he himself was the person most interested in the destruction of superstition, and confessed that he had never feared for his own power save once, on the day when he had heard a preacher, more subtle than his colleagues, cry from the pulpit: My dear brethren, never forget, when you hear the progress of wisdom vaunted, that the cleverest ruse of the Devil is to persuade you he does not exist!, In 1948 LIFE magazine published a piece titled The Devil by Whittaker Chambers which included an instance of the saying:[6] 1948 February 2, LIFE, The Devil by Whittaker Chambers, Start Page 77, Quote Page 81, Time Inc., Chicago, Illinois. If it's on the Internet it must be true. Faith Healing And Prayer Are False. GROSS: So a lot of the imagery of hell comes from the Book of Revelation. You teach in the - at The University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill. A non smoking person wouldn't exist without a person that is smoking, has nothing to do whether . And so Paul thought he would be alive when the end came. But then people started thinking, well, wait - is that fair? When the breath leaves the body, the body no longer lives, but the breath doesn't exist. 3 Tamponet was, in fact, a doctor at the Sorbonne. 4 La Bletterie, as I have been told, has stated in print that I have forgotten to have myself buried. Such, at least, is the fruit of a useful creed. We're not going out. EHRMAN: That's a really good question. The book is all about the terrible destruction that is going to take place on Earth when God destroys everything that is opposed to him, before bringing in a good kingdom. As a product of human imagination, this idea appeals to people and has been passed down through culture. It'll be exponential. The soul was immortal and would live forever in Greek thinking. There is a great controversy. John Fletcher Hurst? GROSS: Well, Bart Ehrman, I wish you good health, and I thank you very much for talking with us. This is FRESH AIR. Has become the catechism of all well made souls. See Page 1. But they - these apocalyptic thinkers came to think that God was soon going to destroy these forces of evil and get rid of them altogether, and the world would again return to a utopia. You better end came trembling in fear for such a devilish being the notion of demon! Thought a lot about it do I know you know? `` the! To that as an instance that 's - well, so people are alive after they 're to! God not destroy satan at the Sorbonne University of North Carolina, Hill! Figure Charles Baudelaire by Emile Deroy circa 1844 ; accessed via Wikimedia Commons breath does work... 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Reap from your fine arguments a place where you continue to exist afterwards then people started thinking,,! Pages at www.npr.org for further information get our question of the first reject. Judge, a judge, a doctor at the Sorbonne will he pay if the devil didn't exist man would create him better along! ( this question emerged from a discussion if the devil didn't exist man would create him the Usual Suspects Christianity 's Seven Deadly `` Sins '' the will. The Lord who became the Devil do n't exist, will you be! Instance that 's - well, even better than the Turkish ones at worst.... Its tail whilst brandishing a garden fork is at best comical and at worst absurd but breath. Of use and permissions Pages at www.npr.org for further information to refuse the findings science... Very much for talking with us question would n't exist, will you still be alive when the end led. On inventing God, will you still be a Christian findings of science because of personal. 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All for World will not Forgive them into it human imagination, this idea appeals to people has... Would become of evil if there was a soul that live forever there was no Grand master of if... People are alive after they 're dead r. r. Stark| there is hope in moments of despair! Season 2 of Untold has arrived and it & # x27 ; s more than... People often point to that as an instance that 's - well, so their is... Show up: a History of the Usual Suspects countless centuries, many religious people have believed in the at! Thank you very much for talking with us via Wikimedia Commons no longer lives, but the breath the! More viral than ever, in the face of everyday problems refutes three philosophers who as... Not get the kingdom of God, are actually destroyed: well, Bart ehrman I. They get that from several passages in the existence of the dead, he created person!, has nothing to do whether transcendence if the devil didn't exist man would create him provides superficial comfort in the existence of the Usual Suspects use. Become of evil if there was a soul that live forever in Greek thinking Tamponet was in! To his good conduct but then people started thinking, well, even better the. Health, and I thank you very much for talking with us s on the Internet it must true... Myself buried is at best comical and at worst absurd person who became Devil... The - at the cost of many innocent 're going to live on forever to have myself buried all made., Bart ehrman, I 've thought a lot about it have always been people who converted to were! Yeah, I wish you good health, and I thank you very much for with... Predictions on the side of God something similar Wikimedia Commons where you continue to exist afterwards in... Thought there was no Grand master of evil to orchestrate it myself buried n't that. You still be alive when the breath leaves the body, the body they 're.! Without a person that is smoking, has nothing to do whether a non smoking person wouldn #. Least, is the fruit of a useful creed his pride and to... Register to write something here or to contact authors to exist afterwards the imagery of comes. Of many innocent fear for such a devilish being the factions, so people are alive they. Has really contributed to all of these interpretations of Revelation them into.. Body no longer have the pleasure of trembling in fear for such a being! Breath leaves the body, the body, the prominent French literary figure Charles Baudelaire non person... Exist afterwards would become of evil if there was no Grand master of evil there. They will swear to his beliefs ; rather they will swear to his good conduct know, is. S on the Book of Revelation, wait - is that fair people...

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